I don’t think 6:35 is my present marathon pace, that would be a 2:52 marathon, and I'm not entirely convinced about 6:42 (2:55 marathon) either, but it sounds more realistic. But keep in mind that the weekend’s pace numbers are straight from the Garmin and experience has taught me that you have to add 3-4 seconds per mile for your real marathon time, taking into account that few of us manage the perfect race line. That means adding up to 2 minutes and Garmin’s 6:48 pace is the slowest you will want to go to break 3 hours, and that pace no longer feels scary.
The HR figures MC gave me are mostly used to avoid going too hard. Had I run 6:55 pace with a HR of 170 it would have been a sign that I'm running too fast. As it happened I had the opposite problem where the HR seemed too low – in that case you have to listen to your own body. I did that to some extend by slowing down a bit after the first mile or two on day 1, but possibly not by enough, which is why day 2 was 7 seconds per mile slower. But I now have a better understanding of what’s involved and will hopefully be able to judge future back-to-back workouts better.
I'm not the first runner to go through all this and as Eric’s comment shows other have gone through similar experiences. Unfortunately that still doesn’t mean that I will be able to run at his pace.
I felt surprising well during Monday’s 8 easy miles but there was a delayed reaction and on Tuesday my legs felt a lot heavier. I could have skipped the hills but didn’t feel quite bad enough for that and decided to go ahead but only do 2 hill circuits. I got a nice surprise when I checked out the dirt road that had been blocked 2 weeks ago by fallen trees. They have finally managed to make it passable again, which means I can return to my usual hill road. For hill training I prefer this to any of the asphalt roads, except maybe for downhill strides.
I have kind of settled into doing high knees every time I'm on the hill because they keep being tough, which I take as a sign that I’ll get the most out that particular drill as long as I don’t overdo it. This time I managed to keep that going for a full minute each and with a little bit of rest I managed 3 of them, with thigh drives as my last drill.
Wednesday morning was almost a carbon copy, except that I replaced the last workout with working the ankles.
On both days the legs felt a bit stiff on the initial set of 4x30 second strides, but according to the Garmin these are getting a little bit quicker almost every time, even though it does not feel like it. The coach thinks I tend to sharpen quickly (which is why Saturday’s pace was faster than expected), which presumably will be taken into account for the peaking phase.
- 7 Feb
- 8 miles, 1:03:31, 7:56 pace, HR 138
- 8 Feb
- 8.7 miles, 1:14:17, 8:32 pace, HR 142
4x30 sec; high knees; thigh drive - 9 Feb
- 8.3 miles, 1:12:59, 8:48 pace, HR 147
4x30 sec; high knees; ankles
Nice analysis, and good w/o. I've only done a few back-to-back hard runs and they take some time to get them right. My one bit of advice, is to have confidence in your coach AND yourself. Sometimes it's easy to rule yourself out prior to even starting the race, don't.
ReplyDeleteTrue enough with the lag between Garmin pace and actual marathon race pace.
ReplyDeleteIf you tend to peak quickly (as I think I do)is there a danger that you might peak too early. Noaks in "Lore of Running" refers to "short swing" and "long swing" athletes with "short swing", as the name suggests, taking a relatively short time to peak but only being able to hang onto peak performance for a few weeks before having to return to basebuilding or risk overtraining/injury (the upside being able to peak several times in a season). "Long swing" athletes on the other hand take longer to peak and can stay in peak shape for longer.
I think you need to reset your mental goals, start believing that you can run run 2.50 something.
ReplyDeleteRunning a successful Marathon requires a great deal of self believe and inner confidence.
Its a lot harder to run Marathon pace in training than in the race where you should be at your peak and fresh, fuelled up and highly motivated!
I think it is realistic to expect a discrepancy on the slow side for actual marathon time. Which is why I agree with Rick. Aim a bit higher.
ReplyDeleteP.S.
ReplyDeletea thought on athletes who peak quickly and athletes who take longer to reach peak fitness.
I remember years ago Greg Lemond comparing himself with the great Irish sprinter Sean Kelly.
lemond said that Kelly could get fit very quickly, while Lemond compared himself to being more like a diesel engine.Taking a long time [many months to reach his peak.
I think I'm more the diesel engine, often I race sub par in the early months of my training and only run well after a great deal of very hard work!
Grellan's comment is interesting (short swing vrs long swing athletes). I'm from the short swing basket.
ReplyDeleteThe thing about all these paces now is they're being run (more or less) on tired legs, so you might not be spot-on with the feel for what pace you're capable of in the marathon once tapered. I wouldn't be surprised if a 2:53-5 pace feels comfortable on the day.